第一次見到紀達夫先生，是2017年11月，Aedas在同濟大學建筑與城市規劃學院舉辦“筑·印”的主題展覽，紀達夫先生專程從香港飛過來，與Aedas全球設計董事韋業啟一起，在鐘庭報告廳為同學們做了主題演講。后來，我陸續在不同的場合聆聽他的演講，領略他的風采，包括超高層建筑產業國際峰會、福布斯論壇、TED演講等，也在很多知名媒體上看到他的身影。感覺他總是思路清晰，精力旺盛，而且在不同的場合有不同的身份，自由切換。在學校，他是一位前輩，跟同學們分享自己的過往心得；在商業論壇，作為公司主席和創始人，闡述公司理念，介紹項目亮點。

I met Keith Griffiths in November 2017 for the first time, when Aedas organized the "City Icon" exhibition in CAUP, Tongji University. Keith flew from Hong Kong for this exhibition and gave a speech with Aedas Global Design Principal Ken Wai at Bell Hall. Following the event, I have listened to his speeches during various occasions, including the Super Tall Building Industry International Summit, Forbes Forum and TED Talk. I felt his immediate charisma during his many appearance on popular media outlets. He is always energetic, clearheaded, and is malleable in his position when placed in various circumstances. At school, he came across as a genuine mentor who had a clear passion for architecture and for sharing his experiences with students. During industry events, he acted as the chairman and founder of the company, explaining Aedas' ideologies, concepts and introducing each project clearly and effectively.

無論從哪個角度，Aedas無疑都是最成功的建筑設計事務所之一，連續15年位列世界十大建筑事務所，作品不僅僅只有超大型基礎設施和商業綜合體，小到一座私人別墅，都做得別有新意。而對于這樣一家事務所的創始人，即使聽過這么多演講，看過那么多資料，我仍然有很多好奇，希望通過采訪交流，可以了解更多。

Aedas is no doubt one of the most successful architectural design firms, ranking as the world's top ten architectural firms for 15 years in a row. Aedas’ designs range from super-large infrastructure and commercial complex to small private villas, all of which exemplify creativity and innovation. Although I have already briefed myself in many of his speeches and have familiarized myself with much of his ideologies, as the founder of such a great firm, I still remain curious, hoping to learn more through the interview.

▲點擊觀看精彩的訪談視頻?Aedas

一、疫情之下的未來城市思考

青年建筑：您認為，新冠病毒從哪些方面影響了我們的生活？是否引起了設計上的變化？世界會恢復到以前的樣子嗎？

In your opinion, how has Covid-19 affected our lives? Do you think the world will go back to normal, pre-Covid-19?

紀達夫：我認為，病毒相對而言不會持續太久，可能持續18個月左右直到疫苗研發成功。但是這次疫情從幾個方面改變了我們的生活。

I think the virus is a relatively short-lived occurrence. I think it may be about 18 months until we can find a vaccine for the virus. However, this epidemic is changing the way we live in two ways.

第一，盡管它并不是引起變化的原因，它將加速社會上已經發生的變化。2003年SARS在香港肆虐的時候，我住在香港，并親眼目睹了疫情前后，社會發生的改變。2003年之前，香港人具有聚集性的社會特征，SARS徹底改變了香港的社交習慣，人們因為害怕，紛紛戴上口罩，社交疏離，以往大規模聚集的活動場所關閉后，人們逐漸形成全新的社交習慣。所以當新冠病毒開始蔓延的時候，人們迅速反應，甚至在最初政府并不建議的時候，紛紛主動戴上口罩。這不是簡單的佩戴口罩習慣的改變，而是社會的整體改變，香港形成了更有凝聚力且更強大的社會力量。所以這次疫情下，中國政府包括香港地區都反應迅速，控制得很好。

First, it will accelerate changes thatare already happening in society, althoughit's not the reason that causes those changes. Ilivedin Hong Kong in 2003when SARS first started to spread. Prior to 2003, Hong Kongwas a very congregational society. SARS has changedHong Kong completely. People got very scared and everyone started to wear masksand keep social distance. Hong Kong people changedfor the better.The venues for mass gatherings wereshut down and people developed new way to socialize. When Covid-19 started, withoutany instructions from the government, Hong Kongpeople wore masksimmediately. It wasn't a change aboutmasks, buta change in societal habits.Hong Kongbecameavery cohesive society, which tended to be quite strong and acted in an effectiveway to benefit the entirecommunity. When Covid-19 came along,the speed at which societyreacted was quite remarkable andthat worked out in both Hong Kong and Chinese mainland.

▲疫情期間Aedas香港辦公室戴口罩上班做好防疫措施

其次，我們正在經歷社交互動轉向網上進行，從物理上的互動，到情感上的在線互動。疫情已經進一步改變這個情況，并推動其加速發展。我們都學習并習慣于使用軟件，方便即時迅速的溝通交流。同時影響的還包括線上零售，它已經成為生活不可或缺的一部分。如果我們結合起來看，會把建筑設計帶向何方？如果人們習慣于線上社交，線下社交疏離，購物中心顯然會面臨大的困境，因為線下購物是基于實體的封閉建筑空間，通過社交互動、消費購物而存在的娛樂方式。

Secondly, we areexperiencing a move fromphysical social interactionsto onlinemental interactions. Covid-19is accelerating the development of this situation. We have all learnt to communicate online and we have new software to do it very instantly and effortlessly.Online retailhas already become an integral part of our life. If we put those things together, what do they mean for architecture?If peoplearecomfortable to socialize online and don't need to meetas much,obviouslythe shopping mall will face great challenges. An offline shopping mall is a closed architectural space based on entities, and a recreational way that exists through social interaction and consumer shopping.

疫情迅速改變這一情形，人們重新反思舊日時光，會發現社交需求依然存在。未來社交空間未必僅通過購物空間提供，疫情的社交疏離結束的時候，人們將對開放空間有更大的需求，可以在舒適安全的社交距離下互動交流。這會影響未來城市的空間形態，人們反思，目前的城市空間是不是真的是我們需要的。改變勢在必行。

The Covid-19got rid of that instantly. People started to reflect on the past and realize that social needs will still exist in the future, but not necessarily through shopping space. When the Covid-19 is over and people come out from social isolation, they will demand more public spaces to interact socially, but at comfortable distances. This will affect the spatial form of future cities. People will think about whether the current urban space is what they need and they are desperate for change.

▲Aedas在深圳C FutureCity的設計中為居民打造了半開放的社交空間，而在商業裙樓的主入口處則預留藝術展覽、商業表演等的活動策劃空間，實現了公共空間與私人空間的平衡?Aedas

▲Aedas在大連恒隆廣場及成都恒大華置廣場等大型商業綜合體項目中均設計了大量的開放空間，賦予城市活力?Aedas

中國正在引領著城市變化，向更加高密度、高層建筑、可持續化的智慧化方向發展?；A建設和交通樞紐將布局更為緊湊，路面機動車數量將減少，給人們創造更多的步行空間。中國的城市人口密度是西方的十倍之多，所以我們需要創造更多的多層公共空間賦予城市活力。疫情提升了這方面的需求，未來開發商在啟動商業項目開發的時候，不得不思考如何提供更多的開放空間，營造更自然的環境。也使得建筑師在項目設計中考量更多社會的需求。

Chinaisleadingthe change. It isleading towards a model of higher density, high-rise cities sustainability. The city will regulate itself in smarter ways. Infrastructures, such as road and railways, will be coordinated to create space for pedestrians and vehicles on the road will be reduced. What we have to realize is that the urban population density in China is more than ten times larger than that of its western counterparts,meaning we need more public space on many more levels to make the city porous. So I think Covid-19 willaccelerate this demand, when developers want to start the commercial development, they will start to think about how to make roofs accessible, moreopen decks, and more outdoor space, and how to have more windgoing through a more natural environment. At the same time, architects will also have to consider social needs and locked them into their designs.

▲多層城市空間中的連接性分析圖?Aedas

同時，疫情讓我們意識到，其實并不需要每天到公司工作八小時。誠然有很多工作需要彼此碰面，使得我們仍然需要到公司辦公。但居家辦公、錯峰上班的那段時間讓我們體驗了更有效率的工作狀態。工作時間跨度更大，可以更自主地選擇自己最富創造力的時間段來思考。這也讓我們重新思考在家中設置專屬工作區域的必要性，而非之前的臨時辦公空間，這會影響未來的公寓設計。

Covid-19 also makes us realize that we don't have to be travelling to an office and working in an office for 8 hoursa day. Of course, we still can't hold without meeting people, so we still have to travel to our office to meet and cooperate. But working from home and shifting travel from peak to off-peak hours will make us experience how we can be more effective at work. We work longer, and will be able to think and create more spontaneously during our most creative time period. This also makes us rethink the necessity of setting up a dedicated work area at home instead of a temporary office space. That’s something we will need to think about when designing apartments in the future.

并且，我也觀察到，一個趨勢正在形成并發展迅速：員工們希望能有更多更靈活的休憩空間和更大的室外空間。這也引起了建筑設計上的變化，未來辦公樓不再是單個樓板加上一圈玻璃幕墻，而需要穿插更多室外平臺。之前，城市底層互相滲透，人們可以通過不同層級進入開放、半開放空間。未來，高層建筑也形成社交空間，實現滲透性。這種趨勢也會促使原本獨立的住宅、商業、辦公向復合功能空間發展。我和團隊順應趨勢，通過設計，努力在高密度城市中呈現靈活、滲透的復合業態建筑，實現建筑改善生活的美好愿景。

At the same time, I found a trend was developing rapidly. Office workers prefer to have more breakout spaces and outdoor terrace spaces. This will also cause changes in architectural designs. In the future, the office building will no longer be a single floor plate with a glass wall around it, but more outdoor spaces need to be introduced. Before, the bottom of the city with porosityallowed people to move in public and semi-public spaces on many levels. In the future, high-rise buildings will also form social spaces and achieve porosity. This trend will also promote the development of residential areas, shopping malls, and offices into multi-purpose spaces.Right now, my team and I are working hard together to present flexible, porous, and complex architectures in high-density cities through designs, thereby hopefully realizing the beautiful vision of improving life by architectures.

▲臺北砳建筑，該項目在辦公建筑中設有城市客廳等開放空間?Aedas

▲印度尼西亞雅加達聯合利華總部大樓中的休閑區與共享空間?Aedas

▲在高密度發展背景下，Aedas在深圳前海傳音總部辦公樓及重慶解放碑時尚文化城項目設計中均設置了多層多功能的戶外休憩空間?Aedas

二、Aedas準則：為真正的使用者而設計，為當地而設計

青年建筑：之前采訪Richard Paul時，他提到RHSP的十大設計原則，Aedas是否也有類似的設計準則？基于設計準則是否有“Aedas風格”？

In the earlier interview with Richard Paul, he mentioned ten design principles of RSHP. Does Aedas have similar design principles?

紀達夫：我和Richard Paul多年前曾經共事，彼此熟識。關于Aedas的設計準則，我認為，建筑需要滿足三方面的需求，首先是業主的需求；其次滿足政府創建美好城市的要求，包括滿足規劃和法規方面的要求；第三，也是最為關鍵的，是滿足社區的需求。因為無論開發商出售樓房，或者政府調整規范，社區始終在那里，所以我們最終是要滿足真正的建筑使用者的需求，這是我們的首要出發點，所有其他的設計準則都是基于這個出發點的。包括啟用本地設計師、與當地居民交流、深入了解當地文化、滿足當地的政府的規劃要求、帶入國際視野、與當地結合等等。

I worked with Richard Paul many years ago, and we know each other well. Regarding Aedas design principles, I think architectures needs to fulfil three elements. Firstly, architecturesmust satisfy clients. Then, architectures must fulfil the government’s aspiration to build a beautiful city, including meet planningand regulatory requirements. Lastly, and most importantly, architectures must meet the needs of communities. Whether developers sell buildings, or governments change regulations, communities are always there, so ultimately, we need to consider the needs of those people who are going to use the building or who will be impacted. That's mystarting point, and all other design principles are based on this. So we need to use local designers, to confer with local people and dig deep into local cultures, to meet the planning requirements of local governments and combine local conditions with international experiences.

比如項目有生物醫學方面的研究，我們會邀請西雅圖的團隊參與；而在成都做設計，就會考慮當地市民的文化和生活習慣，包括因為當地氣候，人們熱愛室外空間、大陽臺、豐富的綠植等。所以，Aedas不需要10條設計準則，1條就夠，就是我們始終要為被建筑物所影響的民眾去設計。

For example, if there is a bio-medical facility project, we will involve our Seattleoffice because they have rich experience in this aspect. However, if we do the design project in Chengdu, we will consider the cultures and lifestyles of local residents, for instance, people there are keen on outdoor spaces, big terraces, and abundant green plants because of the local climate. So we don’t need ten design principles. We just need one. We are designing for our people who are impacted by ourbuildings.

▲Aedas 設計的長沙華遠云璽綜合商業體以張家界的獨特景觀為原型，以張揚個性為當地消費者提供多重感官的購物體驗及引領潮流的風尚中心

攝影：CreatAR Images

相比較于設定特定的品牌風格，Aedas更希望真正做到扎根本土又立足世界，并且充分融入當地文化為使用者服務，所以我們放棄設定品牌風格的想法，即使給自己貼標簽更利于進行銷售獲取項目，因為業主更容易理解和歸類。在Aedas，設計師被充分授權進行創作，結合他們自有的設計風格，以及在Aedas獲得的國際視野，再通過對項目本身和城市文化的研究，將所有這些結合一起，研究項目的問題，得出符合當地解決方案。

Compared to setting a specific style, Aedasalways works hard to be local and global, and truly embedded ourselves in the cultures we design for. Weneed to drop the idea of creating a stylistic brand, even though labelling yourself is easy for sales and getting more projects, as clients can understand and categorize your brand easily. In Aedas, designers are fully empowered to design. They work on the projects and get solutions by combining their own design style, international visions and their research on the projects and urban cultures.

▲義烏之心的建筑形式取意漢字“川”，映射自古以來義烏河對城市商貿發展的重要作用，其石磚墻設計則與舊城墻門相呼應，象征著義烏從傳統到現代的蓬勃發展?Aedas

青年建筑：您所期待的Aedas設計發展目標和前景是什么？

What do you expect Aedas to develope in the future?

紀達夫：我希望在未來，Aedas不只是個設計事務所，更可以成為一個專業的咨詢機構，可以在社會需要的時候提供最專業的建議，比如我擔任了領展房地產投資信托基金的非獨立董事，不時為領展旗下物業的建筑設計提供顧問意見。我們的其他設計董事也正在越來越多地參與到城市建設中，從基礎設施設計到高層建筑的打造以及城市規劃方面，為城市發展出謀劃策，不只作為設計公司，而更像是給城市治病的醫生、城市發展的觀察者、思考者和引導者，同時通過設計工作參與其中，了解城市，幫助城市，融入城市。這些無法一言以蔽之，但我希望Aedas可以朝這個方向發展。

In the future, I hope that Aedas will not only be a design firm, but also a professional consulting agency where we use our expertise in providing professional advice benefitial to the society. For example, I have been serving the Link REIT in Hong Kong as a Non-Executive Director and advises on the architectural design matters.More and more of our design directors are also involved in such roles in various aspects of urban development. We want to be not only a design company, but more like an urban design doctor, a watchera guide, and a caretaker of urban development. At the same time, we will understand the city, help the city and integrate into the city with our design work. These can’t be described just with a few words, but that’s the direction I’d like to see as Aedas moving ahead.

▲Aeads在中國設計的基礎設施助力城市發展，高鐵香港西九龍站攝影：Paul Warchol

▲深圳西麗綜合交通樞紐地區城市設計?Aedas

▲施工中的珠海橫琴國際金融中心，加速中國城市化建設，攝影：CreatAR Images

▲Aedas為長沙新區打造323米超高層長沙金茂大廈?Aedas

三、Aedas學院式文化

青年建筑：Aedas作為全球唯一將國際研究，本地知識和環球業務相結合，扎根本土又立足世界的建筑設計事務所。如何定義“全球唯一”？其他設計公司會爭辯說，他們也是結合本地知識和國際實踐的設計機構。是什么使Aedas如此出色或者說獨特？

Your website states that Aedasis the world’s only local and global architecture and design practice driven by global sharing of research, local knowledge and international practice.How do you define “world’s only”? Because some other design firms will argue that they are also design firms with local research and global practices combined. What makes Aedas so outstanding or unique?

紀達夫：首先，Aedas是學院式的全球平臺，在公司內部共享知識、經驗、軟件、金融、管理和法務工具等。其中，建筑設計的知識和經驗的共享最為重要。這要如何實現呢？我們在每個項目上都會安排兩名設計董事，一名主要帶領團隊投入設計，而另一名聯合設計董事則來自另一個團隊，最好是另一個城市，彼此之間形成設計思維的互通。比如我在香港做上海的項目，就會邀請上海的董事聯合設計，他可以讓我迅速了解上海的信息而進入項目狀態，而我也為項目帶來更多國際視野。而同時，由于他也經常和倫敦、中東或者新加坡的董事聯合設計參與各地的項目，互通資訊，同樣具備國際視野。所以通過這個平臺，每個設計董事都具備當地文化和全球視野。

First of all, it's a collegiate global platform which shares knowledge, experience, software, financial tools, management and legal tools in the company. Most importantly, it's a shared platform of architectural design, knowledge and experience. How does it sharethat? Every project we do has two design directors, one of them, is the design director that runs the team who is going to design the project and the other one must be from a different team, and ideallyfrom a different office, in this way, they can complement each other in design thinking. For example, if I'm designing a project for Shanghai in Hong Kong, I will probably invite one of the Shanghai directors to work with me as a jointdesign director. The Shanghai director can help inform me of Shanghai andbe acquainted with the culture, allowing me to start the project immediately. The Shanghaidirectoris also internationally visionary because he has been working as aco-director, possibly on a project in London or the Middle East or Singapore. Therefore, through this platform, every design director in this company is well informed of local cultures with an international insight.

▲紀達夫工作中與設計師們合作交流，共同設計項目

并且，我們每年會舉辦3-4次全球設計峰會，邀請全球不同辦公室的20-30名設計師匯聚一處，在有限的時間內專注項目設計和討論交流。平時各地的同事天各一方，而此時通過一同設計，分享建筑心得、建立友誼。所以能看到，Aedas通過各種方式來構建建筑智慧共享平臺，使各地員工能真正地融入公司文化，了解項目的日常進程，跟全球同事分享知識。

We have a Global Design Summit for 3or 4times every year, where 20 to 30 designers gather together from different offices to discuss project designs. Usually those people work on their projects at different places, but by designing together, they share their knowledge, understandings and build a good friendship. So we constantly try to find new ways to build new intellectual networks, so that our staff across the world can really embed themselves into our corporate culture, understand the day to day issues of projects and share their knowledge with colleagues in the rest of the world.

▲于英國威爾士圣大衛德舉行的Aedas第十三屆全球設計峰會

▲于摩洛哥馬拉喀什舉行的Aeads第十四屆全球設計峰會

青年建筑：Aedas的官網只展示40個左右的精選項目，每個季度進行評估篩選調整，這是否是對設計創作的一種鼓勵機制？

There are only about forty featured projects shown on Aedas front webpage, and Aedas evaluates and updates the list every quarter. Is this an incentive mechanism for design creation?

紀達夫：Aedas官網上會呈現大約100個項目，其中40個是精選項目，這為公司內部營造了良好的競爭氛圍，利于建筑師的成長。對于設計師來說，這不僅是呈現在官網上而已，更意味著團隊受到認可，會被推薦到媒體進行宣傳，能參與評獎、贏得競賽、得到肯定等等。所以我們創造了這樣的氛圍：設計師之間激烈競爭，同時又讓他們意識到，需要互相溝通學習，形成互動，才能更好地激發設計靈感，完善自己的設計。所以設計師之間交流非常頻繁，不同辦公室的設計師經常通過各種渠道互相探討，既彼此切磋又互相學習，因為閉門造車出不了好的設計。我們也經常對新完成的項目進行評估，擇優呈現在官網上。

We have around 100 projects on our website, among which 40 are featured projects. I think this create a competitive atmosphere in the company, which isgreat for architects’self-development. For designers, it’s not only about presenting projects on our website, but it also means their teams are recognized and will be recommended to the media, enter the contests and even win prizes. We create this atmosphere, where designers are competitive, while at the same time, they realize they need to interact with each other and draw more inspirations for better designs. Therefore, designers make very frequent exchanges, designers in different offices often discuss with each other through various channels, competing with each other, but also learning from each other, because a good design can’t be created behind closed doors. We also frequently evaluate newly completed projects and present the best selections on our official website.

Aedas部分精選項目：

▲北京大望京綜合開發項目?Aedas

▲臺中商業銀行企業總部“臺中之鉆”?Aedas

▲北京新浪總部大樓?Aedas

▲無錫恒隆廣場?Aedas

▲香港國際機場中場客運廊?Aedas

▲香港富臨閣?Aedas

此外，為了鼓勵和嘉獎設計創作，我們有非常平等和公平的分享機制，任何員工都可以盡所能的成長，并沒有天花板的限制，可以最終成為股東，成為公司的所有者之一。很多公司并不會對普通員工開放股份的認購權，在Aedas，當你到一定級別，就可以購買股份，一起分享公司的利潤。目前公司已經進入到第二代的管理團隊，我們也證實了這種商業模式的穩健和成功，它激勵員工創造出好的作品，讓公司有點像研究型的學院。

At the same time, in order to encourage design excellence, we have a very equal and fair sharing mechanism. So our employees are incentified to do well. They can grow and move up as much as they can, without ceiling restrictions, and eventually become a shareholder and even one of the company's owners. Many companies do not offer subscription rights of shares to ordinary employees. In Aedas, when you reach a certain level, you can buy shares and receive dividends. At present, we are having a second-generation management team in the company. We have also proved this business model to be very successful and robust, inspiring employees to create good works, which is similar to a research institute.

▲Aedas 全球董事

青年建筑：除了公司內部的智慧共享，Aedas如何將設計理念傳遞給大眾，對整個建筑行業產生影響和推動？

Besides sharing knowledge within the company, how does Aedas spread out the design principle to the public and influence and promote the whole construction industry?

紀達夫：盡管我和其他董事經常各地宣講Aedas的設計，但是我們認為影響行業的最佳途徑，仍是通過繪制圖紙，向業主傳達創新的理念，最終建成項目，通過實實在在的項目實踐來影響行業。由于項目周期長，我們在設計的時候，至少要確保5-10年的前瞻性，所以保持資訊的迅速更新非常重要。

While other design directors and I always talk about Aedas designs at different places, we still believe that the best way to influence the industry is to convey innovative ideas and our vision to clients through drawings and finally realising the project. Considering the long project cycle, we must ensure our designs are at least 5-10 years ahead of time when doing them, therefore, it is very important for us to keep the information updated quickly.

其次，我們從中國排名前列的建筑高校招募應屆生，也包括留學歸來的優秀研究生。這些年輕的設計師非常有天賦，能很快融入Aedas的團隊氛圍，被充分授權參與設計，可以很快的發揮所長。他們會樂于將自己在Aedas的工作體會告訴朋友、同學、同行們，于是，訊息就會逐漸在業界傳播。我們意識到，中國已經搭建了許多強大的線上傳播網絡，發展更是日新月異。我們的業務大部分在中國，因此我們非常重視這些即時傳播平臺，希望讓業界能第一時間聽到我們的聲音并能迅速反應。這種傳播方式也反過來影響其他區域的傳播渠道和方式。因此各個辦公室的設計董事包括我自己，都安排越來越多的時間在線上視頻和采訪，講座等方面。近期由于疫情的影響，更多交流通過網絡進行，包括在線上網課，我們也逐漸適應視頻交流，包括在鏡頭前畫圖。

Secondly, we recruit fresh graduates from the top architectural universities in China and excellent overseas graduates with an MA degree. These young designers are very talented and can fit in with Aedas team very quickly, who are also empowered to be involved in designing, and can bring their strengths into full play. Their positive experience at Aedas creates a word-of-mouth buzz about the company. We are fully aware of the advent of some powerful networks in China, and great changes are taking place every day. Since most of our works are in China, We are very keen to reaching out on these instant social media platforms so that we could get our message acrossand respond quickly.And this communication approach also affects the communication channels and approaches in other regions. So all the directors in different offices, including myself, are doing more videos, talks and interviews like this. Recently, due to the Covid-19, many exchanges have been conducted through the Internet, including online courses, and we have also gradually adapted to video communication, including drawing in front of the camera.

▲Aedas于同濟大學舉行“筑· 印”主題展覽及講座

青年建筑：Aedas連續15年列為世界十大建筑事務所之一。成功的背后除設計外，Aedas對于公司架構與管理有哪些安排？

Aedas has been listed as one of the top ten architectural firms in the world for fifteen consecutive years. Apart from the design, what arrangements does Aedas have for the company's structure and management?

紀達夫：很多公司里的建筑師疲于應付他們本不用做的事務，比如財務、法務、和政府部門打交道、行政等工作。而Aedas招聘專職人員分擔這些工作，最大程度地釋放建筑師的時間，使他們專注于和業主與使用者的溝通，全身心投入建筑設計。作為1400人公司的主席，我仍然投入70%的時間在設計上，你可以想象其他設計師的比例會更高。

Architects in many companies are struggling with too much work they shouldn’t do, such as financial and legal work, dealing with government departments, and administrative work. We recruit full-time staff to share these tasks and free up our architects' time to the greatest extent, allowing them to focus on communicating with clients, and on architectural designs. As the chairman of a company with around 1,400 staff, I still devote 70% of my time to designing. You can imagine other designers spend more time designing.

在公司的決策角度，我們也有不同之處。除了香港辦公室規模較大，有650人左右，其他辦公室規模較小，但他們都是較為自主的當地化辦公室，在項目上，不受香港的指令，能完全根據當地的項目進展，由設計董事和團隊自主決策。充分授權后，設計師全力以赴，自主設計當地項目。

The decision-making process in our company is also different. Compared with Hong Kong office with 650 employees, our other offices are smaller, but these local offices can make their own decisions. In terms of projects, they are not subject to the instructions of Hong Kong, and design directors and teams in those local offices can make their decisions based on the actual progress of their projects. Once they are empowered, local designers work together to lead the project.

四、個人分享

青年建筑：您不光專注于設計，同時做很多學術方面的交流，包括授課、演講、出版等。隨著公司的發展，您的角色和時間分配是否有所調整？您認為交流的重要性在哪里？

You do both designs and academic work, including lectures, publication, etc. As the company grows, has your role and time allocation been adjusted? What do you think is the importance of communication?

紀達夫：35年前，公司成立之初，只有兩個人，那時候我已經在大學教學，同時做著設計的工作。大概20%的時間在教學，70%的時間在設計?，F在仍然如此，我有很大一部分時間在教學，只是更多的在公司內部，我是公司唯一沒有固定團隊的設計董事，因為我和不同的團隊進行合作，指導團隊工作，在設計中貢獻我的經驗和知識，同時也從團隊中學習，學習不同城市和社區的文化。我喜歡交流，因為我享受交流的過程，讓我懂得傾聽對方的反饋，讓我同樣學到東西。建筑實踐絕不僅僅是簡單地坐著畫圖，它包括與人的交流。

When I set up the company 35 years ago,there were just two of us. I had been a teacher in a university as well as a designer. I spent about 20%of my time teaching and 70% my time designing. This is still the case. I spent quite a big part of my time teaching, actually more teaching in the company. I am the only design principalwithout a fixed team in the company, because I work with different teams, inspire them, and contribute my design experience and knowledge. In return, I also learn about different urban and community cultures from those teams. I like to communicate, and I enjoy the process of talking and getting feedback, where I can learn so much. Architectural practice is more than simply sitting and drawing, it includes communication with people.

▲除設計工作外，紀達夫經常參與行業論壇、校園講座等與他人交流分享

青年建筑：您推薦的 J.G.Ballard 的《Vermilion Sands》這本書中描述的景象，像一面鏡子一樣印照著現在全球的局面，您推薦的另一本卡爾維諾的《看不見的城市》被很多建筑師所喜愛，我本人讀后也非常喜歡，能否與我們分享一下您喜歡這兩本書的理由？

The scene described in the bookVermilion Sands, which you’ve recommended in the past, reflects the current global situation. Another bookInvisible Cityby Calvino, is loved by many architects and I quite enjoyed reading it. Can you share with us the reasons why you like these two books?

紀達夫：Vermilion Sands 是在閉環的環境中，關于社會的隱喻。事態如何變得錯亂，正是對當今的我們的強烈隱喻，就像現在的全球環境，隨著病毒的肆虐，一些國家控制住了，一些國家失控了，和書中景象如出一轍?！犊床灰姷某鞘小肥且槐竞喍痰钊梭@嘆的作品，可以從幾個維度解析。首先，全書設定了一套十分工整的矩陣式的框架，將所有 55 個城市包羅其中。同時，它十分怪誕離奇和魔幻。馬可波羅向忽必烈汗描述他到過的所有城市，每一個特征明顯，像是個寓言故事，而寓言故事又限定在框架之中。它形成 了對建筑的強烈隱喻，雖然并非刻意為之。藝術家會幻想神奇魔幻的事物，而建筑師能通過在嚴格框架下的建筑物加以實現。有時候約束下產生偉大的藝術。藝術家經常跳出盒子思考，但你需要那個盒子?？柧S諾通過設置工整的框架，將眼花繚亂的景象加以呈現。兩本書完全不同，都不是建筑師所寫，也并沒有試圖解讀建筑，它們探討了完全不同的事物，我都很喜歡。

Vermilion Sandsis a metaphor, depicting a society in a closed-loop environment. How things go wrong is like what we see now in the world today. As the Covid-19 is spreading across the whole world, some countries are under control, while some are not. That is precisely the same as what is described in the book.Invisible Citiesis a short but amazing book which can be interpreted from different perspectives. First of all, the book sets up a very rigid framework and everything of these 55 cities has to be within this matrix framework. Secondly, it's fantastic, fabulous as well as magical. Every city is a magical city because Marco Polo is trying to tell Kublai Khan about all of these cities that he has been to, each of which is distinctive, like a fairy tale. But each is a fairy tale within a rigid construct, and I think that is such a strong metaphor for architecture, even though it is not intended to be. As artists, we dream of fabulous and wonderful things. As an architect, we put those fabulous and wonderful things within the rigid construct of the practicality of buildings. Sometimes great art is cultivated from a restricted environment. Artists must think out of the box, but you also need a box to think out of, and Calvino, by setting up that very restricted framework, goes into the spectacular round.The two books are completely different, neither of them is written by architects, and neither of them attempts to interpret architectures. They discuss completely different things, and I enjoy reading them both.

▲《Vermilion Sands》和《看不見的城市》兩本書

青年建筑：如果當初沒有選擇成為建筑師，您會做什么？

What would you have done if you had not chosen to be an architect?

紀達夫：首先，并不是我選擇了建筑，而是這個方向自然而然的形成，也不會有別的結果。自小，優美的建筑、空間就很吸引我，引導我不由自主地用畫筆表現出來。當我還是孩子的時候，14、5歲左右，我就已經算是個專業的小畫家，幫助別人繪制并且賺取酬勞。而且，我擅長通過二維的圖畫，將腦海中的空間表現，和別人進行交流，自然而然，越來越多的人借助我的幫忙來描繪空間。所以，如果建筑師這個職業不存在的話，我也許會成為藝術家或者雕塑家，因為去構建空間和形體真得很吸引我。

First of all, I didn’t choose to be an architect, but this direction was formed naturally and it wouldn’t be any other way around. From an early age, I was always drawn to beautiful architectures and spaces, and I couldn’t help drawing them. When I was around 14 or 15 years old, I was kind of an artist, painting to earn money. Moreover, I was good at expressing the spaces in my mind through two-dimensional drawings. Communicating with others so naturally, more and more people came to ask me to help draw spaces. Therefore, if there is no such thing as an architect, I would have been an artist or a sculptor, because constructing spaces and shapes really appealed to me.

▲Aedas主席及全球設計董事紀達夫（Keith Griffiths）

由于疫情的原因，我們通過遠程視頻連線完成了這次采訪，但即使隔著屏幕，我都能被紀達夫先生的熱情和真實所感染。對于有關公司發展的問題，也許他已經講過無數遍，仍然會耐心而全面的闡述，因為這是他堅信的理念。

Due to the pandemic, we conducted the interview online, but even across the screen, I was infected by Keith Griffiths' enthusiasm and authenticity. Although he has spoken about the development of the company on numerous occasions, he still remains patient in his explanations throughout the interview as his passion for the industry and the company’s ideologies were very prevalent.

除此之外，我們還談到他推薦的書籍也被很多其他建筑師們所喜愛，他有一種 "英雄所見略同" 的興奮；被問到："如果沒有成為建筑師，您會做什么？" 的問題時，他大笑了，深思了一陣才給出答案。我們在一個半小時內暢談了他的職業生涯和建筑行業的方方面面，他以獨特的視角將觀點娓娓道來，語調真誠而略帶興奮，讓我獨享了一次思想火花的碰撞，也期待下一次能更近距離地領略他的風采。

Amongst his experience, Keith also spoke on books he recommented, sharing his excitement when hearing the books are coveted by many architects. He reflected if his life would take a turn, with a laugh, had he not become an architect. Keith’s insights were intriguing, his tone – sincere met with great excitement, as we delved into the ins and outs of his career and the fascinating industry, that is: Architecture.

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